Omega til høyesterett for å stoppe gråmarkedshandel

[krille]

Omega i USA havner nå i amerikansk høyesterett (Supreme court) i en sak mot lavpriskjeden Costco. Kjeden kjøper Omega-klokker gjennom grå kanaler og selger billig i butikkene sine. Dette synes Omega fint lite om, og fikk medhold i en lavere rettsinstans, men Costco har nå anket og fått saken opp for høyesterett. Les mer om dette i The Wrist Watch Review og hos Seattle times.

Dette er etter min mening et overgrep mot et fritt marked og jeg finner det helt utrolig at Omega har fått medhold en gang. Omega må gjerne nekte å ha noe med gråmarkedsklokker å gjøre, og være så grinete og vanskelig de bare kan mot folk som har handlet klokker hos Costco, men dette forsøket på fri omsetning av varer synes jeg ikke hører hjemme noen steder.

 

[GunR]

Omega i USA havner nå i amerikansk høyesterett (Supreme court) i en sak mot lavpriskjeden Costco. Kjeden kjøper Omega-klokker gjennom grå kanaler og selger billig i butikkene sine. Dette synes Omega fint lite om, og fikk medhold i en lavere rettsinstans, men Costco har nå anket og fått saken opp for høyesterett. Les mer om dette i The Wrist Watch Review og hos Seattle times.

Dette er etter min mening et overgrep mot et fritt marked og jeg finner det helt utrolig at Omega har fått medhold en gang. Omega må gjerne nekte å ha noe med gråmarkedsklokker å gjøre, og være så grinete og vanskelig de bare kan mot folk som har handlet klokker hos Costco, men dette forsøket på fri omsetning av varer synes jeg ikke hører hjemme noen steder.

Prestisje skal med ha men betale, det gidder dem F**n ikke. Omega skal stå for høy kvalitet, service og i eksklusivitet. De krever mye mer av forhandlerene sine enn mange andre merker. Så at de blir sure når noen slår beina under dem er da ikke rart.
Håper Omega vinner, dette blir en sak sak som kommer til å skape presedens.

 

[krille]

Prestisje skal med ha men betale, det gidder dem F**n ikke. Omega skal stå for høy kvalitet, service og i eksklusivitet. De krever mye mer av forhandlerene sine enn mange andre merker. Så at de blir sure når noen slår beina under dem er da ikke rart.
Håper Omega vinner, dette blir en sak sak som kommer til å skape presedens.

Her er det vel ingen som slår beina under noen? Hvis en forhandler på helt 100% lovlig vis greier å få tak i X antall Omegaklokker, og vil selge disse videre - mener du at det skal være ulovlig? Mener du da at forretninger som selger brukte ur skal være forbudt? Eller er det lov så lenge uret er litt brukt? Eller skal omsetning av brukte og nye ur (forsåvidt all omsetning av ur utenfor AD) være forbudt så lenge det ikke følger med stemplede papirer fra AD?

Det henger ikke på greip uansett hvordan en snur og vender på det, og blir i mine øyne uansett et overgrep mot et fritt marked og fri omsetning av lovlige varer.

 

[Anders]

Prestisje skal med ha men betale, det gidder dem F**n ikke. Omega skal stå for høy kvalitet, service og i eksklusivitet. De krever mye mer av forhandlerene sine enn mange andre merker. Så at de blir sure når noen slår beina under dem er da ikke rart.
Håper Omega vinner, dette blir en sak sak som kommer til å skape presedens.

Jeg er mest opptatt av kvalitet og service, og synes ikke eksklusivitet bør være noe som skapes av kun høye priser. Service må man selvsagt betale for, men det jo fritt for Omega og gråsonehandlerne å nekte de som har kjøpt på Costco. Jeg håper absolutt ikke de vinner

 

[JonL]

Gråmarkedet er et stort tema på de ulike internasjonale forumene. Serlig i USA. Det generelle rådet er å være forsiktig og skeptisk, samtidig som jeg kjennert flere svært seriøse samlere har benyttet selgere litt utenfor systemet...

Det blir spennende å se hvor denne saken ender

Jeg er personlig litt skeptisk til gråmarkedet. Ikke fordi fri konkurranse er usunt, men har alltid vært forsiktig på forum med å anbefale gråmarkedhandlere med de risikoer det kan innebære.

Det finnes noen veldig skikkelige selgere, men man finner også de som absolutt ikke er det. Alltid greit å sjekke selgeren først om det ikke er en AD. Et problem er at garantiansvaret ofte ikke blir ivaretatt på klokker solgt i gråmarkedet. Dette gjelder ikke bare Omega.
Et annet problem er at bruktprisen på klokker uten skikkelige papirer - åpent garantikort ofte gjennspeiles i bruktmarkedet for de som selger like fort som enkelte medlemmer på klokkeforum - selvfølgelig ikke her


De verste gråmarkedselgerne er etter min mening de som fjerner serienummer. Som om de har noe å skjule.

Her er en artikkel klippet fra chronocentric som forklarer litt mer om gråmarkedet for de som er interessert.

Gray Market Watches
Even reputable new watch dealers may be selling 'unauthorized' watches--know the risks and problems you may face after buying
What are 'gray market' watches?
How can I tell if a watch is gray market?
What does it mean to me if I buy a gray market watch?
What does it mean if the seller removes the serial number?
What are 'gray market' watches?

There are many places where you can buy fine watches. The most important concept to understand before making a purchase decision is the difference between gray-market versus authorized dealers and how that affects the price, warranty coverage, and resale of a watch you purchase.

All genuine Omega, Rolex and other fine watches come from the maker's factory. The maker only sells them to authorized dealers and distributors. To establish and maintain an authorized dealer relationship and volume discounts, authorized dealers must make large initial investments in inventory and continue to purchase minimum quantities of watches over time. This can involve minimum initial and ongoing inventory purchase requirements as high as US$ 250,000 for a single dealer to carry each major brand.

For smaller dealers, this often forces them to purchase more watches than they can sell directly to their customers and to hold in inventory an excessive amount of merchandise of a single brand. So some authorized dealers sell off at wholesale prices the surplus to the 'gray market' of unauthorized dealers--who then sell the watches at heavier discounts than authorized dealers are allowed to. This is not explicitly illegal, but it usually violates the authorized dealer or resellers agreements with the manufacturer.

The manufacturers, to protect their authorized dealers from the heavier discount offered to the consumer by the non-authorized dealers, refuse to provide in-warranty service on these watches. Unfortunately, this policy usually ends up hurting the uninformed consumer more than it protects the authorized dealers. The reason this policy is an ineffective deterrent is that the customer needs to know this before they buy the watch. But only a small percentage of buyers know this before a purchase. Many do not discover this until after they have a problem and are refused in-warranty service by the manufacturer or an authorized repair center. At that point, the customer sees the manufacturer as the bad guy for refusing to honor a warranty on a watch the customer feels they bought legitimately.

How can I tell if a watch is gray market?

Gray market watches are genuine watches from the original manufacturer. They are not fakes or factory seconds. The only thing that makes them different is that they passed through an unauthorized dealer or reseller on the way to you. (Though occasionally, some less ethical gray market dealer may also sell old stock, returns, or refurbished watches as if they were 'new' merchandise.)

Here are probable signs of a gray market watch:

Is the dealer's published price more than 20% off the manufacturer's listed retail price?
Is the manufacturer's warranty card missing or not stamped with an authorized dealer stamp?
Is the serial number missing off the watch?
What does it mean to me if I buy a gray market watch?

Gray market fine watches are typically available at discounts of 30-40%, compared to the maximum 20% discount the authorized dealers are usually contractually allowed to give you.
Note that there are legitimate cases where an authorized dealer may give you more than 20% off current list price on a fine watch. When a dealer has stock they acquired before a manufacturer's price increase, when the watch is a returned or clearance item, or when they bend the rules when really desperate for end-of-month sales (particularly if they have a very large amount of returns after Christmas).

While some gray market dealers are very honest and forthright about what they are selling to you, others may not mention that their merchandise is gray market or make it clear that you do not have a manufacturer's warranty on the watch.
Your manufacturer's warranty card will not be stamped with an authorized dealer's name--or you may get no card at all. In either case, you have no valid manufacturer's warranty coverage. Watches described as having 'open papers' means the warranty has not been validated by an authorized dealer.
If the dealer includes a warranty of their own, it will only be good through them--it will not be honored by any other dealer or the manufacturer's authorized service centers. For this you must trust the reputation and stability of that dealer to repair your watch within the warranty period. Otherwise, any repair will be at your expense.
Some gray market watches have had the serial number removed from the outside of the case (but not the inside) to prevent the manufacturer from tracing it to the authorized dealer that sold it to the gray market. See the following section for more information on watches that have had their serial numbers removed.
Ultimately, the difference is whether you are willing to risk warranty, resale, and other problems in return for saving another 10-20% off the cost of the watch.

What does it mean if the seller removes the serial number?

Having a watch with its serial number removed has several important implications:

Although not often enforced, many states and countries have laws making it illegal to possess an item that has had its serial number removed. Such laws treat watches with altered or removed serial numbers as the equivalent of stolen property.
The manufacturer's authorized repair centers may refuse to service the watch even outside the warranty period. Even worse, some manufacturers have been known to confiscate such watches that have been sent to them for service.
Lack of a serial number may interfere in getting an insurance claim paid if your watch is lost or stolen.
It may interfere with your ability to resell the watch or may reduce what someone is willing to pay for it.
Some manufacturers can supply you with detailed information on your watch--such as its date of manufacture, country it was shipped to for original sale, features and movement calibre, and even a copy of the COSC certificate for your watch--but only if you have your serial number.
Yet, a number of unauthorized watch sellers have a common practice of removing serial numbers from watches they sell to protect their supplier who have violated their contracts with the manufacturers by reselling merchandise to unauthorized resellers. So who protects you, the watch buyer?

The answer is that you have to apply the primary buyers rule of 'caveat emptor' -- buyer beware. If you are unsure about the status of a seller you are considering buying a new watch from, ask them specifically if they are an authorized dealer for the specific brand of watch you are buying. If not, you may want to consider shopping elsewhere.

For more detail on protecting yourself when buying watches--expecially Omega--see the Chronocentric article Omega Consumer Alert: New watch dealers with questionable policies.

If you have already purchased a watch and discover that it has had its serial number removed, you should immediately contact the seller and insist they refund your full purchase price or provide a replacement watch with its serial number intact.

The most alarming part of the way these laws are written is that, once you become aware that the serial number has been removed, you effectively become an accomplice to the crime! Here is an example of such laws from the State of Georgia, in The United States:

A person commits the offense of criminal use of an article
with an altered identification mark when he buys, sells,
receives, disposes of, conceals, or has in his possession
a ... watch, watch movement, watch case ... from which
he knows the manufacturer's name plate, serial number,
or any other distinguishing number or identification mark
has been removed for the purpose of concealing or
destroying the identity of such article.

A person convicted of the offense of criminal use of an
article with an altered identification mark shall be
punished by imprisonment for not less than one nor
more than five years.

 

[Frodo]

Dette er en absurd diskusjon.
Det er produktet som teller. Servicen er uansett avhengig av hvordan den lokale forhandleren opptrer og det er høyst variabelt, etter min erfaring. Omega klarer aldri å fullgodt kontrollere det uansett. Jeg håper de taper.